Fallback from UbuntuMATE - What is the development status of MATE Desktop?

Development Discussion
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Given the evident void of messaging that can reassure the Community of UbuntuMATE's "business continuity", I am enough of a realist to accept that it may not have a future. :frowning:

Let there be no mistake: I would be ECSTATIC to hear actual confirmation from Leadership otherwise ... and I pray that we will all hear such news in the near future!

Being resigned to accept the fact that such may not be the case, can someone who has authority make a statement in this forum regarding the "business continuity" status regarding the MATE Desktop itself?

I think the entire Community would be greatly relieved to hear a clear statement regarding development efforts having retrenched with a re-aligned focus returned to the more essential core, being the MATE Desktop itself, and ensuring that it continues, at the very least, to be accepted as part of the Ubuntu main repository.

I am sure many would prefer to hear that it would continue to be cross-compatible with multiple distros, but, again, I am a realist enough to recognize that keeping it fully integrated with one Distro is work enough, let alone multiple distros. That being the case, is Xubuntu the most compatible Flavour for a single integration, or is there a different Ubuntu-base "ISO" which would be a better "fit", in the sense that keeping the MATE Desktop functionality "intact" would be that much easier because of a shared GTK3 base?

May I solicit such a comment?

(@Wimpy , @vkareh , @monsta , @M.aD , @raveit65 , @lah7 , @guiverc )


Going out on the limb, is there a Nix-based build of MATE Desktop that we have not been made aware of? I can't speak for others, but I would be curious enough, and willing enough, to give that a spin, if I were offered the chance. :slight_smile: I just hope that I don't have to unlearn all the Unix/Linux shell commands in order to make that work.

Thank you ... for taking the time to consider my request and sharing a clear view on where things stand.

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I'll respond partially, as I'm not involved with the MATE Desktop, and thus can't speak with authority/knowledge on that topic.

I was using Debian before the Ubuntu project even started (2004), and I've never stopped being a user there. Whilst I'm a Ubuntu users most of the time, I still use Debian, and it'll be on Debian (forky) where I've likely used MATE last I bet.

I also have a Fedora install here, and happily move files, and even desktop configs between my Ubuntu, Debian & Fedora installs without issue.. but I do try and keep them somewhat aligned timing wise (ie. I consider versions of software when I move stuff between them; but I keep those pretty aligned). The major difference I need to watch for when I move configs between my boxes isn't the base OS, but that whilst this Ubuntu box has 5 displays connected; my Debian & Fedora (or OpenSuSE) box only have two displays and even Debian & Fedora/OpenSuSE differ in alignment (Fedora & OpenSuSE are dual boot on same box so those two are identical); ie. that's a form factor difference issue I always need to adjust for.

I'd be happy using MATE on Ubuntu, Debian, Fedora, OpenSuSE and others.. in fact do/have. The major differences between them are not the desktop (ie. not MATE), but support length (LTS etc), coverage of repository, release model (rolling, stable etc) and other stuff. One of the things I like about Ubuntu is it tends to be easier (whilst for me it's not far from Debian where I started in the 90s).

If you want a pure Ubuntu + MATE system; I'd probably start with Ubuntu Server and then add packages.

Xfce is progressing on their move to Wayland (releng:wayland_roadmap [Xfce Wiki]) and isn't perfectly aligned with the MATE desktop (in timing of move to Wayland), thus starting with an Xubuntu install could vary between releases if you plan on switching desktop metapackages.

I started using Ubuntu by always installing Ubuntu Desktop, as I could download that quota free, then by switching my mirror to one that was also quota free; I'd switch desktops by removing/installing the flavor metapackages and still not be at risk of my home internet flipping to dial up speeds when I hit my monthly [bandwidth] quota, so I'm very used to that. The major thing I discovered is that software changes over time, and thus if you do XY&Z with one release, doing the same XY&Z on another release (where metapackages have changed) may not result in a perfectly identical result. Where the packages were packaged by Debian+MATE for Debian release and for a Debian [LTS] release, don't forget that's in the odd year (vs. Ubuntu being April in the even year). ie. if you do something and it's perfect on say 24.04, whilst you may get the same result if you did the same on 26.04, you may not come 26.10 in the future, even if most things worked as expected. You would get more consistent results I believe if you started with a Ubuntu Server ISO & then added the MATE desktop if comparing 24.04, 26.04 & 26.10 being my point (as against Xubuntu or another flavor ISO).

As for your choice of Xubuntu - yes it would be the closest Ubuntu flavor in my own opinion too.

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I was giving my opinion as to a target for the MATE Desktop development Team, not a target for my own "development".

As you may have seen from some of my other posts, I was, ("was" being underlined) looking at trying to build on Ubuntu Sever, but that has come to a grinding halt because I can't sort out the issue around Brisk Menu not being updated with new categories and launchers for newly installed Apps (i.e. Firefox).

The focus of this post was about what the Developers have as intended outlook going forward ... NOT what options I have available for me to entertain. I do that investigating on my own, all the time, but I am tired of working in a vacuum of information. Truly exhausted, mainly because I don't have the knowledge/experience of the software tools that were used to build Distros or the MATE Desktop. As can be seen with my postings, I have always tried to share the knowledge I harvested and refined into readily reusable form, and shared back with the community in the form of what I consider well-formed (meaningful variable names), well-structured (at least as best as I consider to make the code both readable and logical) and reusable (in the form of handy working scripts/programs/tools).

But that was not my focus with this topic of discussion.

I need this topic to be focused on a clarity of intent being communicated by the Development Team, especially its leadership, for the MATE Desktop.

I dearly hope that that will occur.


As for everything else you shared with us, I do appreciate the time and effort it took to communicate that to us. The information was not wasted. Thank you.

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@ericmarceau I too have been thinking about this myself.

With each passing day it looks more than certain that Ubuntu MATE is done and at the same time there isn't much coming out of the MATE camp either and since the release of 1.28.2 there doesn't appear to be much happening on the development side of things (last blog entry was 2+ years ago).

With that being said it makes me wonder if any alternatives to Ubuntu MATE that would include the MATE DE are even worth pursuing in the long run IF there's no active development happening with MATE and if this is the case then eventually a few years down the road the apps included in 1.28 with eventually become outdated/unsupported as many have in 1.26.

I'm not in any way saying that the MATE DE is done as I have no first hand knowledge of any type and I'm simply speculating here. But with the lack of any communication the WHAT IF? bug is already in my head.

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Thank you, Norm, for showing interest.

HOWEVER ... I don't want this topic to fall into the repeated pattern of opinion pieces shared by non-Development Team members.

We ALL need this to become a clearly communicated messaging, one way or the other, regarding MATE Desktop itself! Yes, I realize this is UbuntuMATE and not MATE Desktop, but UbuntuMATE was a vehicle to make UbuntuMATE truly shine, as it does, but going forward, the incompatibilities stemming from falling behind with integrating the upates of various libraries, will begin to show up as a "loss of shine", thenceforth translating into loss of comfort with the environment, trust it is performing as expected and, eventually, intent to depend on it going forward.

If MATE Desktop is to "fizzle out" and become part of the fabric of history past, that would be a crying shame for the "how" it ended up, undeservedly so, amongst the others that have found themselves on the trash heap.

I rarely beg, but PLEASE, doesn't the Community ... that has stood by the work of art and science that we have adopted as "our own"... deserve at least some clarity of intent going forward?

I have to say that this WILL be my final request on this topic!

I hope that it is worthy of a meaningful response.

Thank you for everything that you (the Development Team) have done for us over the years. It is very sincerely much appreciated!.

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I posted on the Ubuntu Discourse

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Thank you again for everything!

Sad but understandable, when priorities shift!

I wish you all the success in your other endeavours!

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Yes all respect and thanks to those advancing things like U-Mate.
I am of the few which made $$ contribution… hope it hasn’t been lost.
I am on 24.04.4 on this production/work laptop - all is fine
I have 26.04 on a separate laptop and it does quite fine also
I’ll soon move full 26.04
Will stick around up to the point it forces me toward something else, i.e. unless what’s ‘under the hood’ prevents being efficient.
But Ubuntu is Ubuntu. Even Mint is Ubuntu… so if a Mate Desktop can be attached to it, I’ll be around.

W

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Thanks Wimpy! I've been absolutely thrilled with the run I've had with Ubuntu MATE. It was so easy, familiar, and yet modern (when I started out with MATE), and helped me become a Linux-only user along the way. Thanks again and best of luck!

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Thank you, Martin (@Wimpy) for a truly incredible body of work.

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